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+--- Thread: The beginning of the end for ORE? (/thread-2055.html)
The beginning of the end for ORE? - Epic_SkyPilot - 01-19-2014
Ok before I even start this post read the entire thing or don't even reply to it. I just have to say how betrayed I feel by almost the entire ORE community. I've had constant problems with cutlass that were completely out of my control to handle, and when brought up to the staff no action was taken. In fact, I was seen as the bad guy, and I was told to "be mature and ignore it." I won't throw that certain staff member under the bus, but how about you be mature and do your fucking job?! I was being harassed by cut on the build server, the school server, and the forums, on my OWN post about his actual ban. And what did he do? He posted on it, mocking me. Disrespecting me, the forums, the rules, the staff, and most of all the entire community.
After going through all this, I did exactly what's expected of me. I brought it up to the staff, and after a few days of lack of response I started talking to staff members in-game. THIS is when I was told to "be mature and ignore it." Are you fucking kidding me?! I was simply reaching out to the very people who are supposed to help me with these problems and I'm blatantly disrespected and ignored. All of that because cut is apparently immune to being banned. He takes advantage of this perk, and the result is the offenses you see him make now. He does this without consequence, time and time again.
This server used to be such a positive place. Sure everyone had their arguments, but they were mostly about disagreements about how certain redstone builds should be made. I NEVER hear any of that anymore, in fact I think this is hardly a redstone server at all anymore. What really gets under my skin is the fact that I so desperately seeked a staff position only for the genuine desire to help the community. I had that intention, and I'm not even given a chance. But now I see Virt, on the school server, representing the staff brilliantly. I was on the school doing a redstone build of mine, much like most others there at the time. Virt joined, and I didn't really notice anything different. However, about 2 mins afterward, a bunch of immature banter surged through the chat, and after looking through it it was obvious that Virt started it by immaturely talking about inappropriate things to a visitor who was actually being extremely disrespectful, and would of been kicked by many other responsible staff members.
Already surprised at Virt's lack of maturity and professionalism, I was completely taken by surprise when he said "swag" about 50 times followed by a link. Obviously wondering what it was, I clicked on it and I'm brought to a page with very disturbing art-type images of distorted humans with multiple limbs and penises everywhere. I'm not saying this to be humorous, Virt posted a link to INAPPROPRIATE MATERIAL!
Tell exactly why the HELL Virt is given staff capabilities if this is the kind of shit he does?! I pursued staff so I could hopefully help out the community, and I'm turned down, but THIS behavior is accepted?! It's just fucking unbelievable. This server is now full of immature individuals, many of them being staff, and I'm powerless to do anything about it. There have been so many injustices towards me in this last month, and I've only found a few responsible individuals that I can seriously talk to about these issues.
This server is going to shit. The members are disrespecting everything then can, ignoring the rules, not taking forum posts seriously (probably like this one), and staff takes little to no action towards it. Apparently it's ok for staff like this to run the server, but the second I go to a staff member that I feel is responsible, I'm shot down. Normally it's not a big deal, but when I'm denied it, and people like Virt get to fill the positions, needless to say it fucking pisses me off.
I hope at least ONE mature staff member reads this, and realizes that I'm trying to HELP by becoming staff! I'm building an entire damn school on the school server by myself so people can learn better. I'm teaching almost every day I'm on, I'm simply trying to FIX THIS! I'm doing everything I can. I'm one of the only dedicated teachers, I help visitors constantly, teach almost nonstop, and without a doubt I'm hardly on the build server anymore because the atmosphere is much more toxic there. Not to mention the shit I'd have to deal with from cut, which staff won't do anything about.
I don't get recognition for ANY of the shit I'm trying to do for this community. There's hardly anyone I can go to now because I feel like they simply don't understand, or don't want to. I only have one staff member in mind when I say this:
I came to you about this recently. I trust you, and I'm counting on you to help me. This entire community is starting to collapse, and I'm trying to do everything I can to help, in fact I'm attempting to go beyond that. For all my efforts all I get is disrespect and ignorance. I get no recognition, appreciation, or even a fucking "thank you" once in a while. I don't know what to do at this point. I've said countless times how all I want is to have the perks of being staff at my disposal so when they're needed I can use them and slowly make this server a better place. I don't want power, I don't want intimidation, and I certainly don't want to change my intentions.
That being said, hopefully you know who you are. If not, then that exactly proves my point. It feels like nobody's on my side, even though I have talked directly to staff members about all these issues countless times, and almost all of them "agree" with me. I think you're sincere, so that's why I reached out to you like this.
With that aside, I just have one question to ask. Am I the same person you knew a month ago. Was I not an argumentative, ignorant, maybe immature person on the server? I think I was. But if you have any sense at all, you'll realize that I'm broken. I am completely humbled, and I'm to the point where I don't even think anyone realizes that I'm being indirectly forced out of a community that I thoroughly enjoy(ed) being part of.
So I asked that question to anyone reading this that knows me even a little from a while ago. I'm a completely different person now. I'm humbled, and I can't see a staff member on the school server without going to them about this. I just desperately need some understanding, and I feel like I'm yet to receive it. When will it stop? When will any of you realize that this is a completely different server compared to what it was a few months ago, and not for the better. But more importantly, when will at least ONE of you realize that I'm just desperately seeking for a way to help. I'm miserable in the position I'm in now.
I'll just ask one more time, without the limitation of oppression that I often feel on the server. How do you deem it right to deny me the tools needed to turn this community around, yet give them to people who take them for granted on a daily basis, and fail to use them like they should. Does that sound a little harsh? Well it isn't, because I'VE WITNESSED THAT FIRST-HAND!! I had problems on the server that were out of my control, and I went to staff in the hopes that they'd help me, like they're supposed to. And, like stated before, I was told to "be mature." That's so fucked up it's unbelievable.
I have a headache with all the rage I'm holding in right now, so I'll cut this post short, which is hard to believe because it's already so long. That right there should prove that I'm not making this up. This server is really going downhill fast, and I'm a direct victim of it. Not only is that not recognized, but my attempts to fix anything I can one step at a time go completely unnoticed, yet somehow everybody knows to screw with me, for some apparently justifiable reason. Do with this post what you will, I said what I meant to say. I'll keep to myself from now on as long as I'm on the server, because I just can't deal with this any more. If you'd like to say a few words to me about this then I'd appreciate it, especially if I've come to you with these problems i'm facing before. If not, fine. I guess that's the way it has to be. Just please take everything I've said here seriously, I think it's fair that I should get at least that respect.
RE: The beginning of the end for ORE? - Iceglade - 01-19-2014
I disagree as much as I agree. First of all, the server certainly has its changed side. But we're not done yet. I still see people all the time working on big projects, helping each other with redstone...
The community has not changed a bit. Not at all. We're still the people we were, and it's only a few individuals that are changing. We get five to ten new visitors every day, and we're generally at this point the second, third MOST respected redstone server out there. More learning happens on school than in many real life classrooms, and our innovation levels are peaking.
As for administration, I'm honestly not sure. I wouldn't be wholly opposed to giving Epic staff, however another option is to have another election, with HEAVY reviewing of each nominee so as to elect a staff or two that is active and truly cares for the community, which Epic does and I think a few others do as well.
But basically I'm saying, don't give up! We're growing as much as we're falling... and I hope that some administrative change could happen and bring us out of this small ditch.
P.S. I just thought of something... remember, don't let happenings on a Minecraft server change you as a person. We are so much more, but in the end we're less important than real life and our own true personalities.
RE: The beginning of the end for ORE? - redstonewarrior - 01-19-2014
ORE is a community, with a self elected staff group with the resources and knowhow to host and moderate a few "official ORE" services. I'd say ORE's fine, that you'd like staff to clean up chat, that you'd like cut banned (probable future), and would like a staff reboot.
Staff members get lazy. It's part of the job, and it happens to even the most fervent of newcomers. Although they have moderation abilities, they have them every hour of day, every day of the year, and so on. You get lazy. It's the same old ORE chat, and you can lose the balance between mod and friend. Staff inactivity was one of the battles we had to fight on the RDF, but all in all, ORE's structured differently (I may post an explanation on how inactivity is a problem, but is less deadly here.) When staff as a whole gets lazy, that is when applications build up, server changes get queued, and chat goes unmoderated. This is the majority of the problem right now. Staff grew to accommodate the winter break's member onslaught, and now has to shrink (dropping inactive members) back to the school season skeleton crew. Beyond that, it needs to add more active members of the community, to keep around the clock staff availability feasible.
I'd wholeheartedly recommend any seemly mature, active, and willing member of the community to staff, but I recommend they learn more about staff before charging in. ORE's staff was put together to service the ORE community, specifically by maintaining and moderating the services, and by picking directions for the server to go in.
For cut, he has been given multiple opportunities to redeem himself, and probably won't get another one. I understand your disappointment at some staff member's response. Before you get out your pitchfork and torch, consider what I said above. We're currently dealing with cut's case, though I'm not sure we're going to enforce stricter rules on chat in general.
Remember, ORE's staff only serves ORE. We set up and maintain servers and beg around for servertime. (ORE's servers are all hosted by staff members currently, but there is no rule saying this must be so. We also maintain the servers, so hosts don't need to worry themselves.) If someone wants to set up a server, we help them. If anyone's interested in, say, a chat group, we help them connect it to OREServerChat. I understand your frustrations, but be kind. Volunteers get busy, and staff's shrinking for the season.
Quick edit:
This post is not a final answer, nor does it explain what we're currently doing. I'd recommend some further conversation.
RE: The beginning of the end for ORE? - Iceglade - 01-19-2014
I will just say that stricter rules on chat (or anything similar) is a terrible idea. We're a server built on trust, and that's what sets us apart from redstoner.com and such.
Personally, I think having a more heavily weighted election (no self-nomination?) is the best course of action. We are, as you said, low on active staff, and I think electing one or maybe two really dedicated players could really make a difference.
RE: The beginning of the end for ORE? - EDevil - 01-19-2014
(01-19-2014, 03:50 PM)Iceglade Wrote: I will just say that stricter rules on chat (or anything similar) is a terrible idea. We're a server built on trust, and that's what sets us apart from redstoner.com and such.
Personally, I think having a more heavily weighted election (no self-nomination?) is the best course of action. We are, as you said, low on active staff, and I think electing one or maybe two really dedicated players could really make a difference.
Problem is that we're already running almost 20 admins. I think we need to check which admins are really that active on the server, and who are a bit less. But i think we can all agree that some members are more active than some staff members.
RE: The beginning of the end for ORE? - AFtExploision - 01-19-2014
I agree with the need for a little stricter control on chat (Hypocritical, I know). But honestly, the only real "immature" people on the server I know of is Cut, dark, Xray_Doc (sometimes), Brit (again sometimes), and myself.
Most staff members are mature, not just "one." I don't know how things are on the school server, but on Build most of the time this doesn't happen. Honestly, I haven't talked to you recently, but I don't think you should be staff if you make a post attacking the mostly mature community and staff claiming it is for the "greater good" if you will, that is not how things are done here.
Most staff are mature, I can only think of ONE staff that would do that, and yes, inactive staff need to be removed. (Like Virt, why is he even staff?) Also, please indent your paragraphs with five spaces like I have done, it makes it so much more professional looking and easier to read than a wall of text.
EDIT: Sorry about the last line, didn't realize that the posts remove excess spaces. But at least put an empty line, it still makes a difference.
EDIT2: Again, I forgot to state something. I still see plenty of people doing large redstone builds and others giving constructive criticism. It is about equal to when I first joined as a visitor around May 2013. In fact, the server has basically remained unchanged since then, except for more members and staff. There was PLENTY of immaturity back then, equal to what it is now.
RE: The beginning of the end for ORE? - Xray_Doc - 01-19-2014
Recently, I have been trying to act more mature or at least keep it contained to the Off Topic section of the forums. But yeah, I would have to agree sometimes I get out of control on the server.
RE: The beginning of the end for ORE? - Guy1234567890 - 01-19-2014
The hallmark of a living organism is a system that is both in constant equilibrium and flux. I was active, now I'm not, and someone has replaced me. As traffic increases, so does staff, and the reverse. This must be the way things are if we are to be a healthy community.
RE: The beginning of the end for ORE? - Epic_SkyPilot - 01-19-2014
(01-19-2014, 06:35 PM)AFtExploision Wrote: I agree with the need for a little stricter control on chat (Hypocritical, I know). But honestly, the only real "immature" people on the server I know of is Cut, dark, Xray_Doc (sometimes), Brit (again sometimes), and myself.
Most staff members are mature, not just "one." I don't know how things are on the school server, but on Build most of the time this doesn't happen. Honestly, I haven't talked to you recently, but I don't think you should be staff if you make a post attacking the mostly mature community and staff claiming it is for the "greater good" if you will, that is not how things are done here.
Most staff are mature, I can only think of ONE staff that would do that, and yes, inactive staff need to be removed. (Like Virt, why is he even staff?) Also, please indent your paragraphs with five spaces like I have done, it makes it so much more professional looking and easier to read than a wall of text.
EDIT: Sorry about the last line, didn't realize that the posts remove excess spaces. But at least put an empty line, it still makes a difference.
EDIT2: Again, I forgot to state something. I still see plenty of people doing large redstone builds and others giving constructive criticism. It is about equal to when I first joined as a visitor around May 2013. In fact, the server has basically remained unchanged since then, except for more members and staff. There was PLENTY of immaturity back then, equal to what it is now.
Yeah I know I tried to indent, but it deleted my spaces, I'll do empty lines from now on. But back on topic, I haven't directly witnessed redstone becoming a less prominent part on our server. I was just having a conversation with a staff member and he pointed that out to me. He said people are less focused on redstone compared to how it was earlier. I realized that was true to some extent, but that original thought wasn't my own.
Anyway, that's not important. Maybe this post came out as me attacking people such as red, proper, newo, dcen, and other staff members that do their job amazingly well. I just have a lot of anger because there's no denying I've been treated like shit from a wide variety of people on the server recently. I'm really aggravated at the people I went to, who didn't do a damn thing about it. But even more so than that, I'm furious as the certain staff member who told me to ignore it, just because he didn't want to do his job. Cut was harassing me right in front of him, and nothing was even said at the least.
I'm not attacking staff as a whole, but what I am saying is I think people see me as a bad member on this server, and I have no idea why. I've tried to be modest up until now, but this constant misunderstanding of me is just driving me up the walls, so I'm just gonna come right out and way it:
I am one of the ONLY dedicated teachers on this server. The only others I can think of are ctjet, coolt, and snug (although not so much recently) Like ice posted earlier, there is accelerated learning going on at the school. What he doesn't realize is that is VERY much because of me. I'm building an entire school campus on my plot, completely by myself so students can learn better. I do all this, and ice just credits the recently skyrocketing learning on the school server to the community. I'm working so DAMN hard on the school, and ice doesn't even acknowledge that.
I don't know what to do at this point. It honestly hurts that so many oppose me being staff. I'm hardly on the build server anymore because I'm just constantly harrassed. I hope at least one person can feel my pain here. I'm desperately trying to better the community, but people like ice and embi just see me as complaining about random things.
That is not the case...
RE: The beginning of the end for ORE? - AFtExploision - 01-19-2014
(01-19-2014, 08:36 PM)Epic_SkyPilot Wrote:(01-19-2014, 06:35 PM)AFtExploision Wrote: I agree with the need for a little stricter control on chat (Hypocritical, I know). But honestly, the only real "immature" people on the server I know of is Cut, dark, Xray_Doc (sometimes), Brit (again sometimes), and myself.
Most staff members are mature, not just "one." I don't know how things are on the school server, but on Build most of the time this doesn't happen. Honestly, I haven't talked to you recently, but I don't think you should be staff if you make a post attacking the mostly mature community and staff claiming it is for the "greater good" if you will, that is not how things are done here.
Most staff are mature, I can only think of ONE staff that would do that, and yes, inactive staff need to be removed. (Like Virt, why is he even staff?) Also, please indent your paragraphs with five spaces like I have done, it makes it so much more professional looking and easier to read than a wall of text.
EDIT: Sorry about the last line, didn't realize that the posts remove excess spaces. But at least put an empty line, it still makes a difference.
EDIT2: Again, I forgot to state something. I still see plenty of people doing large redstone builds and others giving constructive criticism. It is about equal to when I first joined as a visitor around May 2013. In fact, the server has basically remained unchanged since then, except for more members and staff. There was PLENTY of immaturity back then, equal to what it is now.
Yeah I know I tried to indent, but it deleted my spaces, I'll do empty lines from now on. But back on topic, I haven't directly witnessed redstone becoming a less prominent part on our server. I was just having a conversation with a staff member and he pointed that out to me. He said people are less focused on redstone compared to how it was earlier. I realized that was true to some extent, but that original thought wasn't my own.
Anyway, that's not important. Maybe this post came out as me attacking people such as red, proper, newo, dcen, and other staff members that do their job amazingly well. I just have a lot of anger because there's no denying I've been treated like shit from a wide variety of people on the server recently. I'm really aggravated at the people I went to, who didn't do a damn thing about it. But even more so than that, I'm furious as the certain staff member who told me to ignore it, just because he didn't want to do his job. Cut was harassing me right in front of him, and nothing was even said at the least.
I'm not attacking staff as a whole, but what I am saying is I think people see me as a bad member on this server, and I have no idea why. I've tried to be modest up until now, but this constant misunderstanding of me is just driving me up the walls, so I'm just gonna come right out and way it:
I am one of the ONLY dedicated teachers on this server. The only others I can think of are ctjet, coolt, and snug (although not so much recently) Like ice posted earlier, there is accelerated learning going on at the school. What he doesn't realize is that is VERY much because of me. I'm building an entire school campus on my plot, completely by myself so students can learn better. I do all this, and ice just credits the recently skyrocketing learning on the school server to the community. I'm working so DAMN hard on the school, and ice doesn't even acknowledge that.
I don't know what to do at this point. It honestly hurts that so many oppose me being staff. I'm hardly on the build server anymore because I'm just constantly harrassed. I hope at least one person can feel my pain here. I'm desperately trying to better the community, but people like ice and embi just see me as complaining about random things.
That is not the case...
Please choose words more carefully next time. You stated only 1 staff member was good anymore. Also, if you want help on school, ask.