Best program language to start with

Best program language to start with - Printable Version

+- Forums - Open Redstone Engineers (https://forum.openredstone.org)
+-- Forum: Off-Topic (https://forum.openredstone.org/forum-4.html)
+--- Forum: Programming (https://forum.openredstone.org/forum-8.html)
+--- Thread: Best program language to start with (/thread-502.html)

Best program language to start with - EDevil - 07-04-2013

Ello everyone!

Now that i've got some more free time in my vacation, i thought that it would be a wonderful idea to explore the world of programming. I already know the basics of C#, this was a lesson on my school. I've 'programmed' C# within Visual studio 2012. Now, C# is al that fun, looks a bit like PHP, in which i am very interested in as well, but after going through a couple of posts on le internet i would highly doubt that C# is the 'ultimate' programming language. So, what is (for a beginner) a good language to start? Any suggestions are appreciated! (btw, not sure if visual is the best software to work with, any personal other favorites / suggestions?)

RE: Best program language to start with - mort96 - 07-05-2013

First of all, I'd suggest getting your hands off of C#. It may be a nice language and all, I don't know, but it's Windows only. Please don't become another Windows only programmer, for us Mac/Linux users' sake :3

C++ is kinda like C#, though more low level. (both C++ and C# derived from C methinks, unless C# derived from C++), and it's cross platform.

You could also consider going the javascript route. That way your users can run your programs straight in their browsers. It's also extremely cross platform - any device which supports the W3C standards will support your program. This is different from the cross platform C/C++, where you have to make platform specific API calls for things like user input or GUIs, and from Java/Flash where the user needs proprietary software made by Oracle/Adobe to run your program.

I myself am a javascripter, and I'm pleased with the language. It does have it's quirks, some caused by leaky abstraction, and because it's not compiled into machine code, it's not the fastest of languages. It isn't too too slow though, I've made some games in it which run at a decent speed:
http://mortie.org/?webapp=ridicule - not completeld yet, but you control a ship and shoot bullets.
http://mortie.org/?webapp=tequilaJumper - you jump around trying to get as high as possible and not fall down.

A third route is to write in a language like C or C++, then compile to something called asm.js - a subset of javascript which runs fine in existing JS engines, but only consists of operations that can be optimised to near native speeds. It's also the kind of operations which run quickly in existing JS engines.

With asm.js, you get the speed of a compiled language, with the accessibility of JavaScript.

my 2 cents :3

obtw, feel free to sue me if I made any factual mistakes.

RE: Best program language to start with - fl3tching101 - 07-05-2013

I'm suing! I actually didn't find any factual mistakes, but there's bound to be one so I thought I'd call it first... Anywho, C/C++ (and by that I mean C++) is my (strongly) suggested route. My first language was Visual Basics, though it was a long time ago and I ended up ditching it cause I didn't think it was a "real" programming language. Well it turns out it is a real programming language of course, but I wouldn't suggest using it as your first language at all, very bad habits. Like two years later, I decided to learn a "real" language, so I took on Java since it was popular as a beginner language. I'm not sure why it is so popular, as a beginners language especially, because it really isn't that great and is pretty bad as far as optimization because of it's virtual machine dependency. Not to mention, the syntax...oh boy the syntax. At first it's all nice and easy, a bit complex feeling, but you just assume that's how programming is...then you get into the ACTUALLY complex stuff and it takes like 200 characters of really weird syntax that is impossible to remember to do something, and it's like "Ooookkkk nevermind then..." So after that, I took up some Python programming (I got my Pi and realized that the "chosen" language for it was Python so decided to look into it), and it turns out, it's pretty awesome really. Now the catch is it's not a programming language, rather a scripting language. So it's not made to program huge programs to calculate like space time or something (I have no idea what I'm talking about but that sounds complex XD) and it is definitely not good for game programming, though it's ok to play around with for game programming. Rather, Python is more aimed toward an Engineering/Mathematical use, or, in the Pi's case, for teaching young kids how to program because it is actually really, really easy to program in. While I do love Python for what it is, it's not a programming language and I wouldn't suggest it for a beginner other than very young children, because it teaches some bad habits. In Python's case it's mostly just the fact that it doesn't require end marks (; after each line of code) and basically relies on spacing and the line of code for it's containment...just not very good techniques for more advanced programming in lower level, more powerful (no lower level doesn't mean more powerful, but I mean more powerful than Python in terms of programming power vs Python's scripting power) language such as C++. After Python, I finally gave in, and started watching a couple of tutorials on C++, not even following them, just watching to see how much I hated the language. C++ is the most popular programming language in the world, and because of that I, of course, COULDN'T in any way actually like it...yea turns out C++ is pretty awesome. So the next day I downloaded the IDE (Codeblocks) and started doing some coding. Really great language, and pretty simple to understand. Some of the syntax is a bit complex, but nothing compared to the Java syntax. I really think C++ is the most important language to learn, and probably the best to learn first, for ease of learning, and first-time experience with the best of the best. Of course you have had experience with another language already, but still same idea holds true. I may be just a fanboy, but C++ is definitely the way to go in my book, and a huge portion of the programmer world will agree. Now about the javascript, as you noticed, I never listed that in the languages I've looked at (though I have looked at and coded some HTML5 and CSS3, but didn't do much with it) so I can't really dis it nor praise it. I prefer code that is executed on the computer, but obviously if you want to get your program out there then it doesn't get more simple than a link to a website and bam, you can start playing. However, for a first language (or first language you really get in depth in) I'd probably say stick with a computer based executable. Hope I helped! Oh, and btw, cool thing about C++ is it compiles straight into a .exe executable program that can be run on any computer of the same architecture/maker/something (not sure what all the specifications are, but like a C++ file compiled on my computer with intel i5 x86 processor would run on pretty much any intel x86 computer, just maybe some differences in if the computer was only 32 bit, or possibly OS specific syntax, example being the delay function is different between a Windows and Linux platform (learned that the hard way)). So like I made a simple game, then compiled it and sent it via Skype to a friend who has pretty much no knowledge in programming and has no "special" software to run a C++ file on his computer, but he was able to play it and give me feedback on bugs. So C++ is great and really mostly cross platform, there are just a few things that need small changes to run on different systems sometimes. Again, hope I helped!

RE: Best program language to start with - David - 07-05-2013

Fletch, maybe use enters? I thinj im experiencing deja vu...

RE: Best program language to start with - VirtualPineapple - 07-05-2013

q_q Apparently, Python syntax and in built thingys for me was very confusing to learn at the start ...

RE: Best program language to start with - Xeomorpher - 07-05-2013

they were easy as hell for me ._.

RE: Best program language to start with - David - 07-06-2013

(07-05-2013, 04:10 PM)VirtualPineapple Wrote: q_q Apparently, Python syntax and in built thingys for me was very confusing to learn at the start ...

Then you most likely didnt know any other programming/scripting language.

RE: Best program language to start with - JeremyG - 07-06-2013

I'd really suggest starting with Python.

RE: Best program language to start with - Xeomorpher - 07-06-2013

and I'd suggest learning how to use it properly <_< *looks at jer*

RE: Best program language to start with - VirtualPineapple - 07-07-2013

(07-06-2013, 08:39 AM)David Wrote:
(07-05-2013, 04:10 PM)VirtualPineapple Wrote: q_q Apparently, Python syntax and in built thingys for me was very confusing to learn at the start ...

Then you most likely didnt know any other programming/scripting language.

Not any scripting type languages before but i have done plenty C++ and other languages which I will not speak of but it was mostly all the simplified things that didn't make much sense like lists in for loops.

RE: Best program language to start with - Xeomorpher - 07-07-2013

or just while 1 Tongue

RE: Best program language to start with - EDevil - 07-07-2013

Ok, i've got some general ideas on where to start. I really can see the benefits of Java scripting, but just like Fl3tching, i want something that's executed on the computer. So therefore i will give C+ a try. However, i will also look some stuff up onto Java scripting cause that seems pretty interesting as well Big Grin

Thanks guys for all of your suggestions & arguments!

(btw, srry for not posting for 3 days, was on vacation)

RE: Best program language to start with - bametje12 - 07-07-2013

Hello EvilDevil59NL

I would start with something like java, vb.net (easy and you learn logic). C # is nice but it's only for windows so limited!

java: easy language if you know C or C #. but very many options

vb.net: easy but limited. more mean for small applactions not for games and heavy applactions

c #: nice language if you learn it well then you will understand Languages such as C + +, Java

Regards Bram Smile

(sorry that i reply after you're reply)

RE: Best program language to start with - EDevil - 07-07-2013

(07-07-2013, 03:19 PM)bametje12 Wrote: Hello EvilDevil59NL

I would start with something like java, vb.net (easy and you learn logic). C # is nice but it's only for windows so limited!

java: easy language if you know C or C #. but very many options

vb.net: easy but limited. more mean for small applactions not for games and heavy applactions

c #: nice language if you learn it well then you will understand Languages such as C + +, Java

Regards Bram (sorry that i reply after you're reply)

haha, np Bram. Thanks for the info

RE: Best program language to start with - Chibill - 07-20-2013

I would say justbasic.

RE: Best program language to start with - Iceglade - 07-21-2013

JustBasic is really a good introduction to programming in general, rather than really a language. If you want to understand syntax, then that's the place to go. Otherwise, (if you want a language), I'd definitely recommend python, because it has good structure as well as "pythonic" one-liners for more algorithmic stuff. The only major difference is the curly braces versus tabs, but that's a change that can be learned in just a few minutes.

RE: Best program language to start with - mad1231999 - 07-21-2013

Start with Intel x86 Assembly. It's pretty easy to grasp, and it'll teach you alot. Once you then move on to high-level languages like C, you'll carry over all of the knowledge of pointer usage and stuff like that.

Good links:
http://nongnu.mirrors.hostinginnederland.nl//pgubook/ProgrammingGroundUp-1-0-booksize.pdf
http://www.cs.virginia.edu/~evans/cs216/guides/x86-registers.png

RE: Best program language to start with - EDevil - 07-27-2013

(07-21-2013, 09:36 AM)mad1231999 Wrote: Start with Intel x86 Assembly. It's pretty easy to grasp, and it'll teach you alot. Once you then move on to high-level languages like C, you'll carry over all of the knowledge of pointer usage and stuff like that.

Good links:
http://nongnu.mirrors.hostinginnederland.nl//pgubook/ProgrammingGroundUp-1-0-booksize.pdf
http://www.cs.virginia.edu/~evans/cs216/guides/x86-registers.png

Was always interested in those type of "languages" as well. I'll check the links out, thanks!

RE: Best program language to start with - eyecikjou567 - 01-19-2014

You should try java Tongue

it is similar to C# but used more often in RL.
Others would be python (haven't done much in it, but is okay)
or assembler.

C and C++ are also option but if you want C go for plusplus.
You have much less header (which confuses me anyways)

RE: Best program language to start with - Iceglade - 01-19-2014

[Image: Ta04sHa.png]

RE: Best program language to start with - EDevil - 01-19-2014

(01-19-2014, 04:45 PM)Iceglade Wrote:

I couldn't have said it better myself.